Ancestral Wisdom & A Shaman’s Healing Path: The Healers Café with Dr. Manon & Ariann Thomas

In this episode of The Healers Café, Dr. Manon chats with Ariann Thomas, Shaman, energy healer, author (and lawyer!).

Highlights from today’s episode include:

At 2:51 – From “I don’t feel well” to “You’re dying.”

At 6:15 – Ancestral Lineage Clearing, an advanced cleaning method

At 8:08 – From Ancestors to Genetic Memories

Ariann Thomas: 28:42

The number one reason we have health problems, we have finance, financial problems, we have relationship problems, we have problems connecting with the divine is because of stress is because we don’t know how to connect with ourselves, with nature, with the world.

Ariann Thomas:  38:56    

First of all, you, you accept people where they are. Okay. You hold people where they are and some people are ready for big changes. Some people are ready for small changes and you take people where they are and you give them what they need in the moment.

About Dr. Manon Bolliger, ND:

Dr. Manon is a Naturopathic Doctor, the Founder of Bowen College, an International Speaker with an upcoming TEDx talk in May 2020, and the author of the Amazon best-selling book “What Patient’s Don’t Say if Doctors Don’t Ask.” Watch for her next book, due out in 2020.


Dr. Manon, ND – Facebook | Instagram |  LinkedIn  |  YouTube  |  Twitter

About The Healers Café:

Dr. Manon’s show is the #1 show for medical practitioners and holistic healers to have heart to heart conversations about their day to day lives.

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About Ariann Thomas:


Ariann Thomas, B.S., J.D., is an international healer, teacher, ceremonialist, speaker, Shaman, and hypnotherapist. Ariann primarily carries the ancient wisdom and subtle energy of an elder, and advisor. She is part Cherokee by heritage and her primary practice is shifting unwanted genetic patterns and Shamanic Journeying. She engages in energetic healing work, teaching, and speaking. She is the author of the Amazon best sellers: Healing Family Patterns: Ancestral Lineage Clearing for Personal Growth (2012) and Changing Our Genetic Heritage: Creating a New Reality for Ourselves and Future Generations (2018) and has co-authored 3 international anthologies.

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Speaker 1:                          00:03                    Welcome to the healers cafe conversations.

Dr Manon:                          00:17                    welcome to the healers cafe. And today I have Ariann Thomas with us and I’m super, super excited to interview her. I’m just going to read a little bit her bio. She is a leading expert in ancestral wisdom. She has been practicing incesteral lineage clearing and genetic healing internationally for over 16 years in private and in group sessions and also trains practitioners. Her energy healing work is based on her 35 years of metaphysics and science studies and in the native traditions of North and South America. Ariann primarily carries the profound subtle energy of an elder teacher, advisor and wisdom carrier. As you will see, she is part Cherokee by heritage and is a ceremonialist and intuitive reader and healer. And she combines ancient wisdom with science to clearly explain our connection to the past to clear, present life difficulties. So thank you for coming. I’m really excited to to ask you questions. I’m find out about, you know, your path to this amazing work and maybe let’s start there. What, what what made you realize that this healing path is, is yours?

Ariann Thomas:                 01:54                    Well, it of course it arose out of my own personal experience as most healers know because I was on a traditional American dream path. I did everything that everyone was telling me would make me happy, which of course it didn’t. Okay. I got a college education and an advanced degree and I was actually trained as an attorney. And so I was doing litigation, had this great job, was making money, working 60 hours a week, being under a lot of stress, working at a corporate job. And one day I got really tired at work and I thought I was coming down with the flu. And so I told my boss, I’m going home. I just don’t feel, well. Two weeks later I was in the hospital and the doctor said, you’re dying. Well, you know what? Yeah. And they sent me home because there was nothing they could do because they had absolutely no idea what was wrong with me.

Dr Manon:                          03:16                    That’s shocking though to be told you’re dying. Like bedside manners!!!!

Ariann Thomas:                 03:25                    And I mean they had, they had multiple experts come in, you know, and check me out. Infectious disease specialists, cardiologists, neurologists, you know, the whole gamut. And they didn’t have a clue as to what was wrong. And so I went home because, you know, they weren’t gonna do anything. And a shaman came to me at my home because I’m part Cherokee. And so this Cherokee Shaman came over and she actually pulled me from the brink of death. And that’s when I actually got in touch with my shamonic heritage. My father was three quarters Cherokee. And you know, I did the traditional religious background that never connected. And after that time it was like I really connected with my heart and with my spirit. And I had been studying energy medicine and metaphysics and that’s where my heart lied. But when I connected with my native American heritage, that’s when I really began my healing journey. [

Dr Manon                          04:51                    Interesting. So what was like, what were you actually experiencing that they would say, Oh my God, like you’re, you’re dying. I mean, I understand that they can’t find solutions. That seems to be a common thread. But what were you, what was life for you at that time?

Ariann Thomas:                 05:09                    I was so tired. I couldn’t breathe i had no pain. I had no headache. I had no stomach ache. I had no muscle aches. I know. I was so tired. I couldn’t walk across the house. I couldn’t pick up my purse. I was so tired. I had trouble breathing. I couldn’t walk, I couldn’t get out of bed. I had no energy. And when my friend came over, she said I was wearing my death mask.


Ariann Thomas:                 05:49                    I was that close to death.

Dr Manon:                          05:54                    And how long ago was this?

Ariann Thomas:                 05:56                    This now? 25 years ago. And it took me years to recover. Then i explored every energy pathway that was available. Yup. You mentioned that. And I did it. And when I talk about ancestral lineage clearing, I called this an advanced healing method because this is not something that you enter into lightly. You don’t ask your ancestors to help you relieve tension and stress. Okay? You don’t ask them to help you figure out the difficulties with your children in grade school. This is about the deep underlying issues that impact your life on a lifelong basis that really are in your bones, that you have inherited from generation to generation, to generation in your family. And I have to say that all of the generations in my family, both on my mother’s side and on my father’s side, were mired in years of pain and disability restriction and constriction and oppression.

Ariann Thomas:                 07:30                    And that was manifest in all the children in my family. We lived very limited lives of ill health and financial difficulties, difficulties in relationships and difficulties finding our life path and our life purpose. And we’d get so far and then disaster would strike, illness would strike, you know, car accidents. And I kept wondering what happened, what, what’s wrong? And I now look back and I can see that these are patterns that we inherited and beliefs that we inherited from our parents and our grandparents that they inherited from their parents that have come down into our genetic memories and into our belief systems that limit us in our everyday lives. You know what, what strikes me too when you’re sharing this is, you know, and it seems simplistic, but it starts by curiosity. You are asking why,why is this happening? You know, and it’s incredible how

Dr Manon:                          08:56                    Just that reflection opens up, you know, further like you get to find out if you keep with the question and you know the work long enough. But that’s yeah. So, so what happened then? So you, you were asking why in part and so how did it all come together like this? Like I’m just fascinated how it happens, you know?

Ariann Thomas:                 09:20                    Well, I continued on my wellness journey until my physical body began healing. And like I said, this was a multi year journey and then I encountered a huge family crisis. Okay. About 20 years ago, my entire family exploded. Now I’m from a family of eight. I have one brother and seven’ girls and they’re six, seven girls. And it came out at that time that there was multigenerational sexual, sexual abuse in the family. Okay. And I had known pieces of this story growing up because I had encountered some of it. And I also knew from my sisters at some of their abuse. And I had also recognized the abuse pattern in my mother. And of course it was a secret. You don’t tell anybody. I mean, this was in the family. And when when my mother was told of the abuse by others, it was like, Oh, you’re lying. You’re making up stories, you know, that can’t possibly be true. And at, and at this point, it all came into the open. It all exploded. And there was there was this huge dynamic of blame, of guilt, of shame of you’re lying. This can’t be true. You can’t say that about this person. No one was talking to each other. No one wanted to resolve the issues. And of course, I’m the family peacemaker, family healer. I’m the one that wants to make everything right and there was no way for me to make everything right.

Dr Manon:                          11:28                    Interesting. No, no, and it’s funny when you say the peacemaker, that is such a common thread. It’s note to healers, right? It’s like making, you know, making peace somehow, you know, in, in what seems like a whole bunch of chaotic vibrations that manifest sometimes in symptoms.

Ariann Thomas:                 11:54                    You recognize that in your, in your journey, right? You couldn’t make peace, right? That was the, it’s a desire. But it’s, tell me more about that. Like, so, so it exploded. There you are, you felt the urge to make peace. But what happened? And so as, as many people have said, you come to that dark night of the soul, you come to that dark night where, where you just surrender. And I was in this deep meditation and I called out to spirit and said, you have to help me. You have to help me find a solution to this because I don’t want to see my entire family broken apart forever. And this is, this is what was happening. And that’s when spirit led me on this journey to the ancestors. Spirit gave me this process, gave me this meditation and this journey where I could go back in time and space and connect with the ancestor where this whole issue began.

Ariann Thomas:                 13:13                    And that’s when I learned that 450 years ago, there was a curse on the family. And it was at the time when of course women were when the power of women was being taken away by the men because they were feeling threatened. And so women basically asked to be given the power to manipulate men through sex. And so what happened is that curse rebounded yet and it became through the generations and abusive power by men. And so the curse actually was reversed. Hmm. Interesting. Wow. And I think that the way it always happens, interesting. It’s what started out as a protective device turned out to be an abusive device. And what spirit showed is that I could ask the ancestor for healing. And when she saw what had happened with that request, she was devastated. She was devastated to see what had happened. And so she asked that blessing from the goddess, that curse from the goddess be reversed. That whole energy field was.

New Speaker:                    13:13                   

Ariann Thomas:                 14:53                    And love and compassion and forgiveness occurred. And that’s the energy that I brought back into the family into the present. .

Ariann Thomas:                 15:09                    And that is what changed the dynamics in the family today.

Ariann Thomas:                 15:17                    And what happened is that the whole genetic structure, the underlying DNA structure that caused the abuse in the family basically shifted. Because as we know for epigenetics, we have the ability to turn on positive genes and to turn off those negative genes. And what I actually did, which I know now from epigenetics, is I turned off the negative chains of abuse.

Dr Manon:                          16:03                    So can you like, I mean this is, it’s fascinating and yes, epigenetics is showing this, but those, for those who might be more on the you know, skeptical side could you, could you expand on that? Like to just sorta like share how, you know, what do you mean by genetic and what do you mean genes can be turned on and off .

Ariann Thomas:                 16:38                    We inherit from our mother and our father, one strand each of DNA, okay. And we all know this from our classes when we, you know, went to school and science used to think that that DNA strand was locked in steel. Okay? Like the steel girders have a bit of a building and you couldn’t change that. What we now know is that our DNA are like building blocks and epigenetics means the materials that are put on top of those genes so that our genes are basically static. When we get those genes, 97% of them, we have 3% that are in our reproductive genes that we’ll not talk about today because this isn’t a two hour program, okay? 97% of our genes are, are neutral when we inherit them, right? Okay. And how we turn on which genes we use and which genes we don’t use is by our environment, our belief system.

Ariann Thomas:                 18:18                    How we think, how we act and the culture that’s around us and how we interact with others, our energy field that is around us and what we encounter in the world. So that if we come from a family and everyone in that family believes that there is magic in the world, we will all believe in magic and all of our genes will respond. When somebody says, I have this magic wand and I now bless you with magic and everything you touch will turn green and your eyes will see everything green because you believe in magic and everybody around you believes in magic and your world will be magic.

Ariann Thomas:                 19:25                    And so our belief creates the world around us and what we eat, what we breathe, what we think, how we act, how we treat other people, how we are treated. And what we think,

Speaker 6:                          19:25                   

Ariann Thomas:                 19:44                    All impacts what genes we have in our body get turned on and which ones get turned off. And as we’re explaining that, so they’re like lack of a better word. Influenceable genes, they can be influenced. And from my understanding is they also can be changed. Like absolutely. So, because I, you know, what I was seeing is here’s a, you know, you’re in a situation where there is a choice to make it a complete drama and tap into helplessness and tap into I can’t do anything. I’m astrange from this family. They’re killing me. You know, all of these kinds of stories or what is it that, what’s the energy that, and you can’t make this up, but you’ve got to, you’ve got to own it and feel it

Dr Manon:                          20:48                    Where you can then generate the shift. And, and I think it just brings that point that, you know, it, it takes, it just takes one to heal. You know, I don’t know if you could speak to that, but that sounds to me like what your, what happened. beause you’re, you know, the odds of shifting everything seemed somewhat, minimal that you could. And so please like share that.

Ariann Thomas:                 21:16                    Remember that when you shift everything in this world is energy and you impact all related bodies with your energy. So when you shift your DNA

Ariann Thomas:                 21:46                    Everyone that has DNA that is related to yours. When I shift mine, there’s also shifts.

Ariann Thomas:                 21:58                    And let me tell you the outcome of that ancestral clearing that I did prior to that time. Not only was there multigenerational sexual abuse in the family, I had several abusive encounters where I was almost raped. I had two nieces that were, that were raped. There was abusive relationships in the family with my sisters. And there was also physical abuse going on, mental abuse going on. And since that time, no one in the family has been raped. The abusive relationships have stopped.

Ariann Thomas:                 22:50                    No other family member has entered into abusive relationships and every single family member is now talking to each other and positively engaged with each other. Wow. That did not happen overnight. It took time for people to forgive each other, to go into counseling, to resolve the issues, to go, okay, yeah, this was happening. And no wonder this occurred in the family. No wonder we had these problems. No wonder this was going on and let’s come together and, and believe me, we don’t talk a lot about that, but the healing has taken place. The healing has taken place.

Speaker 2:                          23:46                    [

Ariann Thomas:                 23:47                    And a lot of the emotional and physical issues that can’t, that arose from that. Those generations of abuse have now just dissolved with a lot of work, with a lot of support and with a lot of additional healing.

Ariann Thomas:                 24:11                    And this can also be addressed with issues that we have from coming from backgrounds of slavery, from coming from backgrounds of being serfs and servants and coming from places where our peoples have been conquered over and over again and from places of genocide and from all of these places of oppression. We carry those in our genes. But that doesn’t mean we have to pass them on.

Ariann Thomas:                 24:49                    So if, if we were to break this, the process of trying to express this in a way that you can answer it earlier, but you know, it’s that, it’s that pivotal point where you have this, this insight and your own energy changes and you’re bringing, you have. an energy of forgiveness and wanting to connect. And then there, you know, over time everything shifted. But what was the, like how do other peoples ah ha,s come in as in, was it the information to start with that this phenomena actually happend And was it your story? Was it that they felt a difference in their feeling space, their emotional, like how did, how did it become like, I would say contagious in the sense of how did you spread this? You know, because I know how difficult it can be. You know, you have a family member that believes in a certain way of doing things and you know, there’s other ways if you go tell them, well do this, they’re going to go, you know, it’s not true or you’re crazy or you know, whatever, whatever my doctor knows best, or all of these sort of things that, you know, we have to actually deal with.

Dr Manon:                          26:20                    So can you really talk about that? How was that transition? How did it happen?

Ariann Thomas:                 26:27                    Sure. Oh, I have people in my family that go, Oh, I don’t believe in that woo stuff. Okay, dear, I love you, but don’t give me any of that garbage. Right? Yeah. So whenever you heal yourself, you heal your family, you heal everyone you come into contact with, you live your life healed. You live your life on purpose. You live your life doing the best you can. And let me tell you, there are specific research studies that show how you can prevent genetic damage and how you can repair damaged genes. Okay? So it is not a bunch of woo woo stuff. Okay? When I first did, when I did my first book, which was all about doing the ancestral journey, going back and connecting with your ancestors, this is a process that indigenous people have been doing for 5,000 of years because they know when something comes up, you got an ancestor back there that needs some forgiveness, that needs to clear some mistakes, because if it’s showing up in your life and you haven’t done anything specific, maybe you got an ancestor back there that had a problem.

Ariann Thomas:                 28:02                    Okay? So they’ve been clearing out ancestor issues for for ages, right? We just lost that ability. But now that we’re learning that when I finished that book, I went, you know, one of these days, I hope science catches up and learns about why this stuff works. Well. Epigenetics tells us why it works. The number one reason we have health problems, we have finance, financial problems, we have relationship problems, we have problems connecting with the divine is because of stress is because we don’t know how to connect with ourselves, with nature, with the world. And let me give you three simple tips that are backed by scientific research about how you can repair damaged DNA. Okay? And you’ve heard these before. Number one, meditation, a regular practice of meditation has been studied and has shown actual brain changes that that have repaired damaged genetic repaired actual damaged genes. Right? Okay. And so if you have triggered so called so-called genetic diseases,

Ariann Thomas:                 30:00                    Longterm meditation can help repair those diseases, so-called diseases, and help you heal your body..

Ariann Thomas:                 30:12                    They’ve also shown that longterm yoga practice, chi gong, Tai Chi the mindfulness body practices that connect you with your body, repair damaged DNA and prevent and prevent triggering unwanted genetic diseases and unwanted genetic triggers. Okay, so it’s not like, it’s not like this is difficult stuff. It’s not like you have to go out and climb, you know, Mount Kilimanjaro, right? These are things you can do every day.

Ariann Thomas:                 31:02                    And another simple one is to do what, what is now being called mindfulness practice and what I call paying attention to the good things in life. Yes, daily mindfulness practice where you don’t focus on the news or you don’t get caught up in the negativity of the world that your body takes in as stress. That triggers all of the, Oh my God, this is awful. And your body feels as despair, as depression, as pa

Ariann Thomas:                 31:49                    If you let that go and you focus on the beauty of the day, the flower that you see on your walk, in the morning. Even if you’re walking from your car to your office petting i your animal, your pet, your dog, your cat. When you, when you get up in the morning, you kissing your partner, you know, kissing your kids. How many people get up in the morning and go kids get off to school without taking that moment to appreciate the joy of children and the joy of having someone in your life and appreciate the sun shining through rain coming down the trees, the simple things in life, having food on your table. Those are the things that, what can I say, plump up your genes and reinforce the strength of your brain, of your body, of your emotions and of your connection with the universe. Those will trigger and activate your positive genes.

Dr Manon:                          33:20                    No, I completely agree with you and I think we, we were a disconnected and out of body society and you know, we don’t, we’re not living in the now or not noticing. The beauty of our, even our own body, our own relationship to our body is, you know, fought with, I’m fighting it. I’m fighting every symptom it produces. And so it’s really, it requires a, a real shift of, of consciousness. But I’m going to be a little pain in the butt here. I’m going to ask you one more time. I’m not peace though, because I get that personal transformation and the more you’ve done, you’ve not just done the work, it sounds like work, but you’ve transformed your being, the more connected to who you are really being in that essence of you, your life transforms. I understand that the, the influence it has, but in your family setting, what is the, is it that people see you and go, what’s with her? Everything’s changed. Is it by example? Is it, what is that like? How did you get your entire family? How did it happen?

Speaker 3:                          34:44                    It’s by example and it’s by energy. Okay. Okay. They first started talking to me, not each other. They first started talking to me

Speaker 6:                          34:44                   

Ariann Thomas:                 34:57                    And then I said, Oh, well did you hear that so-and-so was doing this? Oh, she was, well, maybe I’ll give her a call. And then it’s like, Oh, well, you know, you really ought to go shopping with her because she knows where to find. And so she went, Oh, but I’m not talking to Julie, but you know, she knows where the best places are and it’s like, well, maybe

Ariann Thomas:                 35:34                    And so that was, and then they started asking me about, you’re looking really good these days. Well, you know, I started, I started eating organic food and it’s really been helping me a lot. And then I had one sister who had some severe health problems and she said, well, what kind of medication are you taking for this? And I was saying, you know, I’m not taking medication, but I’m using these supplements. And she started doing this. And then my brother I did heart, I cleared heart disease in the family and he goes, I don’t want to hear any of your ……..stuff. Leave me alone. Right. He, he followed his doctor’s orders for about three months and went back to eating his diet of cheeseburgers and French fries and smoking. And all of that. And he goes, leave me alone. And, and it’s like, I, I love him and I continue to hold him in love and compassion and, and it’s just, he gets to choose. He gets to choose.

Ariann Thomas:                 36:45                    My other sister who was cleared for heart disease, she started eating organic. She followed her doctor’s orders. She was exercising, she cut down on her smoking, was not far from quiting and she was doing great. She was like all off of all of her heart medication. And so my brother was talking to her and so, you know, he saw how well I was doing. He started organic gardening, started going to lunch with his daughter. He started, you know, just generally walking around the neighborhood. And what do you know if he’s off of all of his medications? He’s going to lunch with the sisters. He’s, you know, socializing and he’s doing fine. And all of a sudden, one of the, one of the sisters had Thanksgiving or Christmas at her house and everybody came over.

Ariann Thomas:                 37:52                    And there was a family reunion and everybody showed up. Now, not everybody stayed the whole time, but every single person showed up.

Dr Manon:                          38:02                    So advice to, to the practitioners and the healers who, you know, are in general, absolutely wanting to see the change because they’ve experienced it. And now in a family setting I, I’m, I’m understanding the dynamic. What about with your, your patients or your clients? How, I mean, I guess you, you’re, they seek you. So there’s already an openness for the shift. Right? but, but let’s say that my, my tribe or you know, not your Pathi physicians, so they see all kinds of different people, a bowentherapist, pain from emotional pain to physical pain. How do you hold that? Like what is an advice you could from your wealth of experience? What could you share?

Ariann Thomas:                 38:56                    First of all, you, you accept people where they are. Okay. You hold people where they are and some people are ready for big changes. Some people are ready for small changes and you take people where they are and you give them what they need in the moment. Okay. Because to tell my brother he needed to go organic to get off of all of his medication and to exercise,

Ariann Thomas:                 39:28                    He would of showed me the door. Totally. Okay. And so I just said, Oh, have a good time. And he took me out to breakfast, I ordered organic, I ordered what I needed, and he goes, how can you eat that stuff? And I said, here, taste it. It tastes pretty good. And he goes, yeah, that’s not bad. He at least took me to someplace where I could choose organic first step and take them where they, where they were, where they are, and then I give my clients a practice to do, to set the energy in when they leave. Okay. I, I don’t do an ancestral lineage clearing practice and go, bless you. You’re fine. Go away. I give them a practice that says, here is what you do when you leave this session and it’s a 30 day practice. Okay, you do this energy practice, you do these affirmations, you create this. And by the way, if you feel like it, here are some additional things that you can do that will help you

Ariann Thomas:                 40:44                    Okay. So I give them suggestions and they can take them or leave them, but I always give them a practice that they can do. Right? Yeah, that makes sense. Right? So it’s things that they can choose to do or not choose to do, but I never leave them empty handed. They go. Right. And they also have additional options after they do a clearing session because I also do soul retrieval, karma clearing and curse release. Because when you have traumatic events in your life, you occasionally need soul retrieval physical healing

Ariann Thomas:                 41:34                    And which I refer them to other people go and work as wonderful, you know massages are great when you’re in trauma and you need physical release and many other kinds of practices. So you know, simply simply letting them loose out the door and saying, fine, everything is now fine. Doesn’t work because it’s an ongoing healing, as we all know is an ongoing process. Yes. That was what I was going to ask you. How would you, what do you define healing as? Definitely. So it looks like or a time is coming to, to a end and I am really thrilled to have you. Again, I know you have a meditation that you walk people through and it sounds like you have a wealth of other knowledge that I know that my listeners would be interested in in listening to and learning from.

Dr Manon:                          42:36                    Do you also have a way, cause I’m on the website, there’ll be a way to connect with you or any gifts that you’d like to briefly talk about that we can share. Yes. On your website there is a link to my website, which is ancestral lineage and I also have some healing gifts for your listeners. I give you a free copy of my first book. There’s some PD apps that will give you some specific guidelines towards changing your genetic patterns also to creating a successful and a link to a couple of my programs. And saving certificate for a private session with me. Okay. Wonderful. That sounds really great. Well, thank you so much for taking the time and I look forward to going deeper or further a further interview. Love to love to be with you again, drThank you so much. Bye. Bye.

Speaker 1:                          44:00                     Thank you for joining us on The Healers Cafe.