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Manon Bolliger (Deregistered with 30 years of experience in health)

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Mel Mason

Mel Mason

How to Look Inside to Declutter Outside with Mel Mason on The Healers Café with Manon Bolliger

In this episode of The Healers Café, Manon Bolliger (Deregistered naturopath with 30+ years of experience in health) speaks with Mel Mason, The Clutter Expert. .

Highlights from today’s episode include:

Mel Mason 09:02

My favorite thing to talk about I mean, all clutter, whether it be clutter, weight, toxic relationship, mounting debt, you know, addiction, all of that stuff accumulates, because of one simple reason. You’re just not willing to look at it and deal with it. Right? That’s, that’s what it simply comes down to. And if the outside is a mirror of the inside, all that really means is you’re not willing to be present with yourself and be present for your own experience. So, the only requirement to get free from clutter in every area of your life is your presence, your presence is required.

Mel Mason 24:49

We all have blind spots we just can’t see ourselves like that’s the beautiful thing about the outside being a mirror of the inside is the reason why that is humans can’t see themselves. We need the outside to reflect us back to us. And so, we need other people reflecting us back to us.

Mel Mason 25:27

I just want people to really get like, the most important thing that I like people to understand is that the clutter is just a symptom. It’s your birthright to experience happiness and abundance in every area of your life. And my belief is clutter is anything that gets in the way of that. And truly the way to get free from clutter in every area of your life is your presence. It’s so super simple, but only your presence is required. That’s all that’s required. You become willing to just turn your attention within and within six months, you’re not going to recognize your life.

ABOUT MEL MASON

7 time best-selling author, Mel Mason is The Clutter Expert, and as a sexual abuse survivor, she grew up depressed, suicidal and surrounded by clutter. What she realized after coming back from the brink of despair and getting through her own chaos was that the outside is just a mirror of the inside. And if you only address the outside without changing the inside, the clutter keeps coming back. That set her on a mission to empower people around the world to get free from clutter inside & out, so they can thrive & experience happiness and abundance in every area of their lives.

 

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About Manon Bolliger

As a recently De-Registered board-certified naturopathic physician & in practice since 1992, I’ve seen an average of 150 patients per week and have helped people ranging from rural farmers in Nova Scotia to stressed out CEOs in Toronto to tri-athletes here in Vancouver. My resolve to educate, empower and engage people to take charge of their own health is evident in my best-selling books:  ‘What Patients Don’t Say if Doctors Don’t Ask: The Mindful Patient-Doctor Relationship’ and ‘A Healer in Every Household: Simple Solutions for Stress’.  I also teach BowenFirst™ Therapy through Bowen College and hold transformational workshops to achieve these goals. So, when I share with you that LISTENING to Your body is a game changer in the healing process, I am speaking from expertise and direct experience”. Mission: A Healer in Every Household! For more great information to go to her weekly blog:  http://bowencollege.com/blog For tips on health & healing go to: https://www.drmanonbolliger.com/tips SOCIAL MEDIA:  – Facebook | Instagram | LinkedIn  | YouTube  | Twitter  | Linktr.ee  

About The Healers Café:

Manon’s show is the #1 show for medical practitioners and holistic healers to have heart to heart conversations about their day to day lives. Follow us on social media! https://www.facebook.com/thehealerscafe

TRANSCRIPT

Welcome to the Healers Café. Conversations on health and healing with Manon Bolliger. A retired and deregistered naturopathic physician with 30 plus years of experience. Here, you will discover engaging and informative conversations between experienced healers, covering all aspects of healing, the personal journey, the journey of the practitioner, and the amazing possibilities for our own body, and spirit.

Manon Bolliger 00:43

So welcome to the Healers Cafe. And today I have with me Mel Mason, she’s a seven time best-selling author, and she is the clutter expert, as well. She is a sexual abuse survivor, she grew up depressed, suicidal and surrounded by clutter. What she realized after coming back from the brink of despair, and getting through her own chaos, was that the outside is just a mirror of the inside. So, I think that’s all I’m going to read. I really want to welcome you here and find out a little bit about your journey, and how did you come to realize this? I won’t give you five questions at once. I’ll do one. But welcome

 

Mel Mason 01:37

Oh Manon, thank you so much for having me. It’s an honor and a pleasure to be here. And so great to see you again. It’s been so long. So yes, the clutter expert I did not get that name by accident, I was the cluttered, messy kid, you couldn’t actually walk in my room, my entire floor was covered. There was no path that anybody else could see to get from the door to the bed or the desk or my closet. But I knew how to navigate it. And I was completely fine living like that. But here’s the thing, it wasn’t just stuff that was all over my floor, like I had trash all over the place like I was fine, living in filth. And I didn’t realize at the time that the outside is only a mirror of the inside. Because early on in my life, even at that point in my life, I was what I call littered with clutter on the inside. I experienced a lot of trauma and loss early on. My parents separated when I was four. And what kid does not take that responsibility on when their parents don’t make it. By the age of eight, I experienced three different sexual traumas by three different perpetrators. And at the age of 15 years old, I lost my older brother to suicide. While I was living with him is when he committed suicide, so I discovered his body. And then his suicide note left me a 15 year old cluttered mess, the soul air of all of his belongings. And so that meant I had to go through his apartment after they took his body out and go through everything and figure out what I was going to keep what other people could have and what we were going to let go of. And already being littered with clutter like I didn’t give a rat’s butt if I lived or died, why do you think …

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my environment looked like that. And so, it just sent me on a downward spiral. Nobody expected me to make it to my 18th birthday alive. And a month later, I got kicked out of my sophomore year of high school and was considered a danger to myself and others. And they said, you can’t come back until you get intensive therapy. And what that looked like for a 15 year old was first getting shipped off to a psychiatric ward for evaluation, then to a diagnostic center for more evaluation, where it was then determined that no you still can’t go home, you’re gonna go live in a residential treatment center for adolescence for the next year of your life, which wound up to be the next 18 months of my life. Well, while I was living there, I was introduced to yoga and mindfulness. And at that point in my life, I was a sponge. And I soaked it all up. And what yoga and mindfulness ultimately taught me was how to come home and be present in my body for that inner clutter. And what that inner clutter is, is the repressed emotions from trauma and loss, the limiting beliefs we accumulate from all the people in our lives that don’t have instruction manuals, the judgments, the fears and all of the resentments that we accumulate. And as a result of learning how to be present for all of that stuff and stop running forward from it within a year’s time that cluttered messy kid went from someone who was fine living in filth, to someone who could no longer tolerate disorder, and I had to have everything in its place. And it happened spontaneously, without effort. and without a plan, I didn’t be like, okay, on Monday, I’m going to work on my clutter for 15 minutes, and then on Wednesday, I’m going to work on it. It just naturally happened as a result of being willing to make the space on the inside, because there’s a principle and operation in the universe called the principle of correspondence…as above, so below or as within, so without, and the more space I was willing to make inside, the more space started to show up outside. And that’s really how I got free from clutter was just being willing to show up for my own experience and be willing to be present for all that inner clutter.

 

Manon Bolliger 04:13

Wow. Wow, that’s the history I did not know at all about you. That’s quite a quite a story. Yeah. And also, now I realized, there’s no way…well, I can let me ask you. I’m thinking, the clutter expert, you know, part of my brain goes like, oh, do you go into people’s homes? And oh, you got clutter here I’m gonna, you know, like, like an organizer of the superficial? Or is your approach different? Or is it even related? Actually, my question.

 

Mel Mason 06:29

Yeah, great question. You know, when I started, I thought that I could get people to do the inner work by helping them with the like, I’ll come in, I’ll help you with the physical, but I’ll also teach you about this inner peace and hope that you’ll actually implement it in between our sessions. And that just never worked. When you go in and you help people clear a surface or organize their closet, you’re just putting a Band-Aid on the problem. And I kept what I would keep showing up. And it would be like the same thing would be cluttered again and again. And it was so discouraging and disheartening, that I transition my business from going into people’s houses to strictly coaching people, because until you become willing to be present for the inner clutter, there’s no lasting change that happens. So, if you want to know the secret to keeping the clutter from coming back, it’s starting from the inside out, not the outside in.

 

Manon Bolliger 07:21

Wow that’s a profound statement. Because, you know, there is a belief out there that if you can keep things organized and tidy, you’re going to feel more organized and tidy.

 

Mel Mason 07:34

Key question is if you can keep it that way. I mean, how many times have you hired an organizer? They’ve created these systems for you, and then you can’t keep up with it?

 

Manon Bolliger 07:45

Right. Yeah, no, and I think that’s what happens. So, it’s very much a band aid approach.

 

Mel Mason 07:53

I mean, it’s the same with like, because clutter is just one external manifestation of the inner clutter, it shows up as carrying excess weight on the body, being in toxic relationships, addiction, mounting debt, being too busy. And what happens when you go on a diet, and release weight, the weight comes back, because nothing changes on the inside, you get the money to get out of debt. And then you find yourself back in debt again, because nothing’s changed. You get out of one toxic relationship, and then you are in another one with just a different face. So, nothing changes unless you change the inside.

 

Manon Bolliger 08:26

So, let’s talk about that. A little bit. What I mean for you it was meditation, and yoga that brought everything into alignment for you. And then slowly but surely, clearly you cleared everything around you. What is it that now with the years that have passed and more experience with all kinds, I’m assuming with all kinds of other ways of dealing with the inside? What is your primary way of helping people?

 

Mel Mason 09:02

My favorite thing to talk about I mean, all clutter, whether it be clutter, weight, toxic relationship, mounting debt, you know, addiction, all of that stuff accumulates, because of one simple reason. You’re just not willing to look at it and deal with it. Right? That’s, that’s what it simply comes down to. And if the outside is a mirror of the inside, all that really means is you’re not willing to be present with yourself and be present for your own experience. So, the only requirement to get free from clutter in every area of your life is your presence, your presence is required. And you do that through a simple practice. I teach my clients which is not meditation, when people hear the word meditation, they’re like, no. It’s absolutely just called allowing the now like simply allowing the moment to be exactly as it is without any need to change anything. because people are just so unwilling to sit still in their own company and be present for their own experience. In my book, Freedom from Clutter that I wrote, there’s an experiment that I talked about where all the participants were first asked, would you be willing to get paid to receive an electric shock? Their like, hell, no, you’re not shocking me, I’m not gonna get paid for it. Then one by one, they’re led into a room, and they’re sat at a table, there’s no window, just the door to come in. And they can just sit by themselves and twiddle their thumbs, they could meditate. They could do push-ups, they could do whatever, they just had to sit by themselves for like 15 minutes, or they could give themselves an electric shock. Over 50% of men, and over 20% of women chose to shock themselves over and over again, rather than being still with themselves.

 

Manon Bolliger 10:51

Yeah, that’s definitely not something that we are. You know, we’re, we’re brought up with typically, it’s a yeah, it’s like, you’re still if you’re punished, if you go into a corner, you know, that which is funny, you know, and now parents call it a time out just slightly nicer. It’s, you know, it’s like, time to what, though? Because what are the tools that you give people? Right? They’re, they’re stuck in their thoughts about either hatred, revenge, or feeling terrible, or whatever it is. There’s like, there’s no, but they’re stuck with it. They’re in their thoughts. Right? So how do you explain people to be present, and observe what’s happening to become the observer in that relationship?

 

Mel Mason 11:46

Yeah, it’s simply just teaching people that you know, when you when you’re just begin to turn your attention within the real magic actually happens simply from your willingness to look within, it doesn’t matter what’s happening, your mind could be racing, you could spend the whole time lost in thought, and have the five minutes go by and still get results, which is beautiful about this practice. I actually liken it to the game of Whack a Mole, you know, the game, whack a mole with a mole pops up and you got this mallet and you got it, they’re popping up from all these different holes and you don’t know where they’re gonna pop up from. And so, for people that have ADD or ADHD are labeled with that, I don’t buy into labels, this is perfect for you. Because you don’t have to quiet your mind. Focus on your breathing focus on a single point. You get to let your attention go to whatever’s calling it in the moment. And there’s physical sensations, there’s emotions, there’s thoughts, there’s sounds, there’s smells, and you might see things behind your eyes. Some people see things behind their eyes, but you just give your attention to whatever is calling it in the moment. Oh, there’s a physical sensation, I feel my sits bones on the chair. Oh, there’s a plane going overhead or oh, I’m feeling some sadness or whatever showing up in the moment. You get to just be present with it and acknowledge it and not need to change it, learning how to just be okay with it, and accept it as it is.

 

Commercial Break 13:07

Manon Bolliger here and I want to thank you for taking actionable steps towards engaging your healing journey, and helping others discover their path by watching, sharing, subscribing, and reviewing these podcasts. Every review and share helps spread the word these different perspectives and choices and options for healing. And to thank you, I’d like to invite you to sign up to my free seven sequence email tips on health and healing for everyday life. You can go to healerscafe.com tips, thanks so much.

 

Manon Bolliger 13:47

So, we’re dealing with the judgment component, right? That that we all have the inner potential for the inner critique.

 

Mel Mason 13:58

And even if you are judging you just like Oh, there I go judging again. Nothing wrong with that either. There’s no wrong it’s just learning how to witness Oh, I’m judging. Oh, I’m worrying. Oh, I feel this feeling or oh, I feel my body for the first time. Some people have never felt their body below the neck.

 

Manon Bolliger 14:16

Yeah, for sure. That’s my field. It’s like hello, hello.

 

Mel Mason 14:24

Oh, I exist here. I mean, I worked with a client one time she was had extreme hoarding behaviors. I don’t call anybody a hoarder with the filth. I mean, dishes piled everywhere trash all over the place, extremely overweight in her 50s and we did this guided visualization and once I got, once we got her done, she was like, that’s the first time I felt my body below my net like 50 years old, never felt anything below her neck before.

 

Manon Bolliger 14:51

So how do you, how do you differentiate the let’s say the child who are the 15 year old, depressed, laying on her bed, looking at the mess, and being at least 15 to 30 minutes in that state, noticing stuff, having thoughts considering suicide, just noticing that from the practice that you’re suggesting, because a lot of, you know, teenagers are noticing plenty of things. Maybe not their bodies, sometimes. But well, that depends. But anyhow. So, what’s the difference in? How do you set it up so that it is effective? And, you know, like, do you know?

 

Mel Mason 15:53

So, it’s, you know, there’s really nothing to set up except for setting specific time to just stop and spin. And it’s only five minutes. Like, you don’t need to spend any more than five minutes like, it doesn’t. Some people start with two because they don’t feel like they can sit still that long. And so, there’s what’s really cool about it is the magic happens just in the willingness because all of this stuff accumulates because of an unwillingness to look at it. It’s like no, I don’t want to see you…know, don’t want to see you. But when you’re willing to just stop and turn your attention within you’re literally doing the opposite. You’re saying yes, I’m willing to see me. Yes, I’m willing, whatever shows up, I’m willing to see. So, there’s nothing special about it. It’s just so profound if you become willing to do it. And I tell my clients, I’m like, if it didn’t happen by accident for me, I’d think you all are freaking crazy. If you were trying to say, oh, just turn your attention within for five minutes, and your entire life is going to change. But it wasn’t just the clutter that cleared up. I was a crack addict and a crystal meth addict. I was homeless on the streets, I was almost 170 pounds. I was in a toxic relationship, I had over $50,000 in debt. I mean, every single area of my life has gotten better from this one practice. And when I stopped doing it consistently, my life starts to go to shit.

 

Manon Bolliger 17:11

Okay, so it’s the willingness, the intention, and the commitment to doing five minutes a day.

 

Mel Mason 17:20

Yeah, it’s just the consistency. It’s like the proverbial drop in a bucket. Right? Like, so, if you think about everything is energy, and everything has a vibration, right? All of that inner clutter has a lower frequency vibration, it’s fear, it’s resentment, it’s all these repressed emotions. But a state of allowing has a higher vibration. And we know in math that a positive and a negative cancel each other out. So, the minute that you’re just willing to look and see, you start canceling out these lower frequency vibrations, and like right now you’re a match to the clutter, you’re a match to the weight, you’re a match to the addiction. But over time, with consistent practice, your vibration starts to raise, and the gap gets big enough that it causes you to act like I didn’t plan to clean my room. It happened spontaneously without thinking about it. Because the inside there was space and the outside just had to match. It’s a law.

 

Manon Bolliger 18:13

Right. Yeah, it is law of nature. But it’s very interesting, the way you’re describing this, it’s faster than it would have had to be lived through.

 

Mel Mason 18:23

Yeah, 100%. Like if it didn’t happen, I mean, I’ve been like, Y’all are crazy. But I’ve watched like, there was a period in my life where I stopped doing this practice, and I got into a toxic relationship. And for six years, I stopped taking care of myself, I stopped doing this, I stopped reading anything spiritual, stopped connecting. And within six years, then all I was doing was giving, giving, giving, and six years, I wanted to commit suicide again. 2013 I was ready to take my life. And I was like, okay, I’m either going to end it right now and come back in another body and start all over again. Or I’m going to do whatever it takes to experience my birthright, which is to be happy and abundant in every area of my life. And all I did was start doing this for five minutes a day. And within six months, I was able to leave a job I was miserable at, step out as an independent contractor. Two weeks later, they’re like, this isn’t gonna work, we have to travel. So, we’re gonna just pay you the balance of your contract. So, they mailed me a $50,000 check in the mail. And then I took six months off, and that’s where I got the idea to create my business decluttering spaces. And I’ve been in business since January of 2014.

 

Manon Bolliger 19:29

Wow, congratulations. I mean, that’s such a great example. And you know, what I love about it is there’s no part of you that says, oh, it’s difficult. It’s hard. It’s, you know, and my experience with healing is it’s not, it’s easy.

 

Mel Mason 19:46

Yeah, it’s not for the faint of heart.

 

Manon Bolliger 19:49

Exactly.

 

Mel Mason 19:50

You had to face yourself, you get to locate yourself. You get to be willing to turn your attention within, but I’m going to tell you like I finally took another six years, but I got out of the toxic relationship. Once I kicked the toxic relationship, I released the weight, I met you, I met Forbes, I wrote a book, I’ve contributed to seven other books that have made me a seven time best-selling author, I got a digital TV show, and I keep manifesting all kinds of money, and all kinds of amazing things just keep happening in my life, and I can’t keep up with my life. And the one thing that I do consistently is this practice.

 

Manon Bolliger 20:21

Hmm. Very good. So, with the coaching then, how, like, if people wanted to work with you, it sounds like yeah, it really…one clue is if they’re places messy, they can definitely relate to you and go, Okay. She’ll get me and not judge me. But so, who? Like, how would a person work with you? Or how? Or maybe I give an example of somebody with no names? Nothing, obviously. But that, you know, that you’ve been able to help? I mean, you’re an extra ordinary case, you know, really, but who else have you been able to help? And guide and coach because I think in all, all coaching, to have a mentor or a person that you can be sort of accountable to helps enormously to keep you on track. And, you know, because we can self-sabotage so easily.

 

Mel Mason 21:27

Yeah, I think the most important thing about coaching is the accountability and the encouragement. But also, as a coach, private coaching, individual coaching is based on your unique individual goals, and each person is different. And so, we work together to figure out what your vision is, what your goals are. And then my job is to help make sure that you crossed the finish line with the encouragement with the coaching, with the accountability based on your goals. But some examples, you know, it doesn’t happen for everybody, the way that it happened for me, the need to have order first and releasing the way getting off the drugs, each person is going to be different. So, I’ve been working with a client for about a year and a half. And she after a year was extremely frustrated that the spontaneous decluttering wasn’t happening. But in the very next sentence, she’s like, but I’ve released weight, and I feel happier. You know what I mean. And another client that I’m working with, I’ve only been working with her I think for not even three months yet. And actually, it was my first corporate client a company hired me to support her because she was really stressed out and lashing out at everybody. And through her being willing to put this practice into place, she got really clear about what she wanted. And she’s giving her notice, and she got to get through tax season watching everybody else in this office go insane. And she’s just kicking back, relaxing, and like in the eye of the hurricane, like, I can’t believe you guys are doing this to yourself. I feel great this year. And you guys are crazy. And I’m out of here. You know. And so, each person is different depending on their goals and what their needs are. My very first client like actually fought the coaching piece and only wanted me to come into her house because she’s my very, very first client, but I always wanted to coach people too. And for the first four years, she wouldn’t coach with me and do the inner work. And once she did, it was like she couldn’t even get through a box of paper on her own without my help. And once she started coaching with me, she was able to get through the boxes on her own, she didn’t need my help to come in her house anymore. And then within two years, she’s like, I don’t need you at all anymore. Like I’ve got this. And then she just had recently, I think it was a couple of years ago, now her mom passed away. And she thought she was going to need me to come out and help her with all her mom’s stuff. But she got through it all on our own. And she only kept a very small amount of stuff that she’s keeping for herself. And the rest she got rid of. And she did it all on our own.

 

Manon Bolliger 23:48

Yeah. Well, I mean, that’s, you know, that’s the, the point of all of these therapies, ultimately, is if you can’t end up doing it on your own, then, you know, it’s not really working. Right?

 

Mel Mason 24:02

Right.

 

Manon Bolliger 24:02

You know, you can’t be addicted to a coach or all that inspired by working with getting to a point but um, that’s, that’s, uh, anyway, that’s a great sign.

 

Mel Mason 24:13

Yeah, I mean, I’ll never stop hiring coaches to keep up leveling my skill set. You don’t necessarily stay with the same coach forever. You keep up leveling and growing and moving.

 

Manon Bolliger 24:23

Yeah, that’s what I’ve done too. And I think it’s, yeah, it’s really, it’s important. It’s, you know, it’s growth on all levels, right. So,

 

Mel Mason 24:32

But don’t ever work with a coach who doesn’t have their own coach. Just FYI. You always want to work with a coach who has their own coach and has continually to work on themselves.

 

Manon Bolliger 24:42

Yeah, I think so. I mean, because I guess it could be a lot of ego sometimes. So, some people you know, so

 

Mel Mason 24:49

We all have blind spots we just can’t see ourselves like that’s the beautiful thing about the outside being a mirror of the inside is the reason why that is humans can’t see themselves. We need the outside to reflect us back to us. And so, we need other people reflecting us back to us. The same advice that I give my clients, my coaches give me, we all everything we say to our clients, we need to hear ourselves. It’s just the way it works.

 

Manon Bolliger 25:14

Yeah, for sure. So, our time is almost up, I just is there anything else that you would like to share that I may not have covered or asked you?

 

Mel Mason 25:27

I just want people to really get like, the most important thing that I like people to understand is that the clutter is just a symptom. It’s your birthright to experience happiness and abundance in every area of your life. And my belief is clutter is anything that gets in the way of that. And truly the way to get free from clutter in every area of your life is your presence. It’s so super simple, but only your presence is required. That’s all that’s required. You become willing to just turn your attention within and within six months, you’re not going to recognize your life.

 

Manon Bolliger 25:57

I’m going to leave it with those words. Thank you so much, Mel and lovely seeing you again and congratulations.

 

Mel Mason 26:09

Yeah, thanks so much for having me.

 

ENDING: 41:33

Thank you for joining us at the Healers Café with Manon Bolliger. Continue your healing journey by visiting TheHealersCafe.com and her website and discover how to listen to your body and reboot optimal health or DrManonBolliger.com/tips.

  * De-Registered, revoked & retired naturopathic physician, after 30 years of practice in healthcare. Now resourceful & resolved to share with you all the tools to take care of your health & vitality!  
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Manon is a newly retired Naturopathic Doctor, the Founder of Bowen College, an International Speaker, she did a TEDx talk “Your Body is Smarter Than You Think. Why Aren’t You Listening?” in Jan 2021, and is the author of 2 Amazon best-selling books “What Patient’s Don’t Say if Doctors Don’t Ask”  & “A Healer in Every Household”.

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Manon Bolliger * Deregistered, revoked & retired naturopathic physician after 30 years of practice. Now resourceful & resolved to share with you all the tools to take care of your health & vitality!

Founder & CEO of BowenCollege.com, Educator, TEDx Speaker, Amazon Best Selling Author, International Speaker, Podcast Host 

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